BW3 proposes calmer look

September 3, 2008
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The back-and-forth continues between city planners and the developer of a new Buffalo Wild Wings restaurant along Washington Street downtown. Franchise owner Pete Watson has offered to tone down the facade a bit, offering this picture: BW3

It appears pretty much the only change is the color, as you can see by checking out old posts here and here and here. (Sorry for the image quality; they didn't submit digitally, so this is a photo of a photo.) What do you think?

  • Phoenix University called and they want their architect back.

  • Better. Still should have had larger windows to embrace the street and not hide from it. I am surprised they did not do the old storefront with outside dining as many restaurants do. I think extending the awning over the whole store front would look better but that is just me. The whole windows thing is still bugging me. Glad that the City stayed firm and Mr. Watson decided to play ball.
  • Well at least it's not that horrifying baby diarrhea yellow. Certainly many, many, many times better. It's still a shame about the windows. There were some great big windows there before. Why couldn't they take advantage of those?

    Ah well, at least it's progress in the right direction.
  • gotta get those cans away from the window and actually USE those windows..
  • Yeah, I agree. Better, but windows that don't actually allow people to look out on the street are pointless. Also, I seating area would be nice but I am not sure is is possible as the usable part of the sidewalk narrows there already.
  • Much better improvement. It won't blind us as we go bye and walk into a tree. Glad that he is playing ball as well. I agree, these look like Tiffany Store windows that they are going to put a plate of wings in one, and their nasty A@@ burgers along with a beer in another.

    Windows should be bigger like most of the downtown building windows are.
  • Personally, I never thought the yellow was THAT big a problem. The stone at the base and the tiny fake windows are the major problems. Make the windows larger and real and the yellow could stay for all I care (larger windows will reduce the amount of yellow anyway). The stone MUST go.
  • BW3 is still completely missing the point.

    They've ignored the potential of this location as a prime pedestrian destination.

    They've squandered an opportunity to add to the street life downtown (for better examples see: Andrus O'reilly's, Coaches Tavern, Slippery Noodle, Champps, Rock Bottom, MacNiven's, etc.)

    They've essentially turned their back to the street and burrowed into a dark hole. It's completely uninviting.

    They could've had one of the best nightlife spots downtown, but they've taken 2 steps back and ruined a great location.
  • For what's it's worth, Buffalo Wild WIngs show sporting events on large projection screens. They couldn't do that with large open windows unless they blacked them out during the day.

    Might be one reason might not.
  • Wrong BigJer, their last downtown location on Maryland St. had big open windows. To reduce the light for sporting even they awnings which is what is being asked for by those on this blog. I really think this is more a matter of BW's wanting all their storefronts to look as close to a model as possible regardless of location.
  • I find it extremely inviting! I actually can't wait until it opens!
  • The size of the windows and the side door looks odd. The door really stands out. The cut stone base also does not fit with the building's original architecture. Lookk at some of the storefronts across Washington St. Why can't the city demand more glass and loose the door or incorporate the door into the glass. Don't blame the architect solely the Owner has the final say.
  • Not much can be done with the side door because the door is not for BW's but is a staircase/fire exit for the upper floors of the building. It is a pretty unfortunate location for it.
  • That security door could be replaced with a standard storefront-type door with opaque/mirrored security-glass inserts and sidelights, to make it match the storefront entry system on the BW3 space.

    Considering that their direct competitor in the wings-and-beer biz (Hooters) has an outdoor deck and big north-facing windows, I agree with those who think B-dubs is missing a big opportunity (and full of it regarding the need for a dark interior and no exterior windows).

    And puhleeze...get rid of that stone.
  • What a mess.

    First of all they should invest a full awning covering the entire length of the store front with ample indirect lighting.(It highlights there location and performs a necessary function)

    Second get rid of the striped pillars, they look cheap and out of place with its surroundings.

    Third get rid of the faux stone and enlarge the windows.
  • BigJer,

    Two words:

  • It IS ugly, it IS a mess, and I agree the weird three-foot high stone wall is the worst part of it. What, exactly, was the architect going for here?

    Then again it's a BW3, the non-descript building has been vacant for years, and not everything downtown has to be perfect and uniform -- isn't that the joy of city life?

    Either way, hasn't this been dissected enough? Glad there's some compromise. This is all about crappy wings for the masses, beer, and sports on the tube. Should be simple enough.
  • Folks, this is the final design. Do you seriously think the city has the balls to make BW3s change the design any further?
  • Camille

    No, because the city is conservative. This design or joke of a design is considered a design in Indy standards.
  • I thought the coolness of a vibrant downtown depended on variety. If all the buildings conformed to an agreed upon standard, we'd have something that looks like a strip mall--not a downtown.

    Viva la difference!
  • OK,'re kidding me...

    They left little boxes of yellow around the light fixtures when they painted?!? They're not even willing to remove the damn light fixtures to repaint?!?!

    This is an insult. You can paint a turd any color but it's still a turd.

    I sincerely hope this doesn't get passed.
  • Ugghh! They still don't get it. Those awnings look like something from a little kids play house (tiny). I really do hope that the city sticks to their guns on the design issue. I agree the access door could be made to look more like a store front window with some frosted glass. A larger awning and bigger windows can let those inside not feel as though their in a dungeon and those outside might want to join those inside.
  • After I get in there and have a couple of drinks I'm not going to really care what it looks like. Like someone else said, they didn't have a problem with the color before and neither did I. But I do like this better. For me it's a place to kick back, relax, watch a game ane have fun with friends and family.

    Dam, you are dumb.

    Anyway, the food is garbage.
  • Actuall, the yellow wasn't that bad. The only problem I have with this is the stone and the fact that it does no address the street well with unused windows. I too support a city where everything doesn't look the same.
  • I suppose we could have them make a wings/beer joint look like a law firm.
  • The juxtaposition of the contemporary, industrial, sleek awnings with the faux stonewall at the bottom is ridiculously bad. That's the major problem with the design, not the color. They make a hideous combination.

    For a true redesign, BW3 needs to pick one theme or the other and start again. If forced to choose, I think most people would prefer the awnings as a starting point over the tacky faux stonework. The awnings could work with more harmonious material choices for the rest of the facade. Right now, including the upper floors of the building, there are too many disharmonious aesthetic styles and they're sinking the whole ship.

    This design is also drawing attention to the wrong things, such as the emergency exit, by fragmenting the awnings. The divided awning is visually interesting, but they way they've executed it is all wrong.

    Why on earth does an ugly emergency exit have its own cute little awning and lights? Does the designer want people to notice how ugly it is? Why does it have as much prominence as the main entrance?

    The funny thing about the awnings is that they're completely decorative. They serve no functional purpose.

    Don't give in Indy planners! Get this atrocious design fixed!
  • ...this BW3 design issue a juggernaut!! (Bob...chill)
  • The design is still horrible....

    And Bob, you spelled DAMN incorrectly in your sentence : Dam, you are dumb.

    I love irony...
  • Unless the interior layout is redesigned (which is what really needs to happen), the designer is going to continue to struggle with the façade. Anything less is just letting the wheels spin and spin. Of course, the designer wants to be paid without doing any additional work, so it is in his/her best interest to try to convince the tenant that a redesign is unnecessary.

    And the tenant just wants the store to open as soon as possible so he can begin operating. The rent will be due soon and it’s hard to pay rent when you have no revenue stream. So he will obviously want to agree with the designer and attempt to persuade the city that this design meets the Regional Center Review Guidelines, which it does not.

    I think the landlord needs to step in and straighten out the tenant. With any luck, there is a clause in the lease that allows for rent deferment in the event that permits are not approved. Clearly, the tenant is overly worried about the rent issue – otherwise this design fiasco would have been resolved weeks ago.
  • Remove the strip mall dryvet and faux stone! Look above and embrace the limestone facade! Floor length retail windows can be open to the restaurant or closed/boxed off as displays while embracing the urban streetscape. If this tacky restaurant can not adapt to downtown send them packing to the burbs!
  • Better....but still ugly. DENIED!!!
  • I like it! No windows is a good thing for a sports bar. Who wants to look out windows. Where are the flatscreens????? That's where I'll sit! Good compromise BW3!
  • Wow Babsey, sounds like you are a big redneck. Sad to see how DOWNTOWN continues to attract hicks.
  • Listen, it is a basic principal of planning and design that the windows at the street level of businesses (especially restaurants, regardless of whether they are sports bars) in the urban core should be large, open and functional. This is because without these types of windows the street scape doesn't improve and the streets are not any safer. These have been pretty standard concepts since the 1960's a la Jane Jacobs.
  • One word: NanaWall
  • like is has been said before, the awful colors weren't even close to the main thing that was wrong with this urban disgrace. its the windows smaller than the marion county jail. its the restrooms at the FRONT of the freaking building. I will lose all respect for the planning department in this city if they let this atrocity let be.
  • Just so everyone knows, the picture is the developer's proposed changes. NO actual changes have been made to the facade yet. I walked by yesterday and it was still atrocious.
  • They are going to have a difficult time getting all of the vomit and urine cleaned out of all of the nooks and crannies in that stone.
  • Looks good to me. Much better than the abandoned blight across the street. Maybe all you urban planners can pool your money and make a real change to the block, instead of criticising those who have put their money where their mouth is.

    Bob, dam has an n on the end.... spell correctly if you are going to call someone dumb.

    SE Guy -- the vomit and urine was around the cornere where all the homeless were before an open business moved in.
  • Quit making something out of nothing. The businessman has been working with the city to resolve, as quickly as the city process works.
    Quit the personal attacks on the guy that are without merit. If you you don't like B-Dubs or how it looks. Take your Subway coupon and wait in line at the nearest Subway with Jerrod.That will free up a seat for all of us bubba's. Isn't this a city/state full of bubba's?
    If anyone paid attention, almost everyone that was asked by Channel 6 about it said they couldn't understand the problem or the problem with the look. Must've been a whole bunch of bubba's.
    See ya'll when the beers flowin'.
  • So sad to see so many business owners and corporations paying for employees to monitor and post on this blog while work/jobs get ignored.
    Don't get me wrong.
    This is a great forum.
    But quit wasting my money when you should be working on your projects.
    Do it on your own time.
  • Damn Damn Damn Damn Damn Damn Damn Damn

    Happy Now!!!!!

    Some people just need to let the little things go.......
  • I just visited Washington Square and noticed how much the BWW (next to Target) looks almost just like the one downtown. Simon must not have allowed them to remove the large exterior storefront type windows, so they've just covered them all from the inside. Maybe they should look alike since they're both on Washington Street (ha ha!)

    What I found peculiar about the Wash Sq location is that it actually has an outdoor seating area without any televisions. I was under the impression that the BWW business model didn't include anyone who wasn't in a dark room and facing a TV screen.
  • Mediocre food to go with their mediocre design. Now - for all who have complained about their lack of design - boycot this BW3 and see how fast this place gets shut down and hopefully boarded up. Then - perhaps another chain restaurant will appear and hopefully some new designer with a complimentary facade to go with the original art deco.
  • idyllic, obviously it's not safe to have sidewalk dining at 100 E. Washington, especially with all that blight across the street.

    The bigger issue is...what were you doing outside 465? There's a Target at Glendale now. :-)
  • Am I missing something? Do buffalos have wings?
  • Good point about the blight Thunder. While Glendale does have a Target now, it still doesn't offer the diversity of high-end shopping options I crave, such as the E. Washington corridor's indoor flea markets and other second-hand stores.
  • Gimme Break, why don't YOU give the rest of us a break and stop being an apologist for a lawbreaker.

    This is not some simple businessman who just didn't know the laws. Mr. Watson is a sophisticated developer who has opened up several BW3 franchises throughout the city. He is well-represented by good attorneys. He KNEW the law and chose to break it because he thought the city would let him get away with it. Now, that he has been held to account for his willful violation of the law, he would love to rely on apologists like you to make the lame accusation of the city picking on some poor businessman. BS! Most people in Indianapolis don't cotton well to people thumbing their nose at the law the rest of us are supposed to follow.

    Mr. Watson should have followed the law in the first place. Now, it will cost him time and money to get into compliance--and I and many others have ZERO sympathy for him.
  • An indoor flea market or secondhand store would be PERFECT across E. Washington St. from BW3, don't you think? It would allow some risk-taking entrepreneur to return those blighted buildings to good use!
  • Bob,
    You also spelled RID with an E

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