New renderings just in: Buckingham's North of South

November 22, 2010
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North of South rendering bookBuckingham Cos. just filed detailed plans of its $150-million North of South development, including street-level renderings of most of the proposed buildings. North of South map thumbThe plans call for a hotel with 158 rooms, 332 upscale apartments, a YMCA branch, and an 800-space parking garage, all north of South Street between Delaware Street and Virginia Avenue. Property Lines photographed the elevations from a filing for Indianapolis Regional Center approval, submitted Nov. 18, since the developer has declined repeated requests for more detailed project renderings. The planning department has not yet prepared a staff report on the project, which is slated to get an $86 million loan from the city. Here are a few images that give a good idea of the project's look:

View of Dolce Hotel

Apartment building elevations

Parking garage and residential

Alabama Street elevation

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  • IndymanNovember 22, 2010 7:44 PM
    Thanks for the pics.

    I like most of what I see. I would like to see the garages look less like garages all the way to the top. The apartments need to either look more like separate townhouses and/or individual 1800's buildings with separate colors and designs. Make it look like an older urban streetscape
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    • Please No
      The HossNovember 22, 2010 10:09 PM
      That's exactly what we don't need. We don't need fantacy 1800's facades. We need solid modern buildings with good fenestration and massing and thats exactly what Buckingham is proposing.
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    • Trendy=Outdated
      HorribleNovember 23, 2010 12:53 AM
      These renderings are nothing more than lazy trendy design that will look outdated in a decade. I HATE the copy cat wanna be modern look that really adds nothing. I like this project, but agree that more classical architecture or something COMPLETELY differnt is needed. There is nothing even of note that would instantly make you know you are at "North of South". No landamrk, fountain, park, blah, blah, blah. At least with Buckingham Cos. Grammercy design it had nostalgia going for it.
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    • I Agree...
      caliboy28November 23, 2010 7:54 AM
      ... with The Hoss. I like the designs as they are presented and appreciate that they are not the same, tired standard brick throwback that we have way too much of already in downtown. I don't understand how someone would think modern, contemporary buildings would be outdated in a few years time, but replicating buildings from the 1800's is somehow going to keep them relevant... huh?
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    • More of the same
      MarkNovember 23, 2010 8:32 AM
      Nothing intriguing about any of this architecture. It is neither trend setting nor unique; it is simply more cookie cutter development in the "new urbanism" way of doing things. If I were in Chicago, I would be more negative, but we're talking about Indy. We Hoosiers aren't exactly "architecturally progressive"...so, I'll take whatever downtown development I can get.

      As far as the parking garage goes, I have nothing against additional parking in the downtown area, but wouldn't it be nice if we could bury this garage and provide some plaza and community green space??
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    • the next step
      JoeNovember 23, 2010 8:52 AM
      I think it would be a great idea to propose this district as 'off the grid'. Provide some solar and wind energy. Use rain water harvesting and permeable pavement. If we are going to help pay the bill for this, then help us in life cycle costs. I will be at the meeting and I will propose this be included, I suggest those that want a better downtown and a better project do the same.
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      • To Joe
        MarkNovember 23, 2010 9:17 AM
        Joe, this project is definitely not going to be "off the grid", but I agree that, without question, this project should implement as many green technologies as possible. Rain water harvesting and permeable pavement should be a given, and particularly responsible material and energy use should be considered. Since they are receiving public funding (regardless or whether it is just a loan), the city should be mandating that they employ responsible design.
        However, I very much doubt that solar or wind energy would be implemented here primarily because of the first cost of installing and implementing these technologies. I would be elated if they decided to pursue it, though. We have to start somewhere...
        I applaud you in your effort though. They should definitely be made aware that the community is watching this and that implementing green technologies is a smart strategy, economically and politically.
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      • Aiming Higher?
        Common CentsNovember 23, 2010 11:28 AM
        If we are betting public money, I would much rather be looking at a picture of NYC East River Science Park in Indianapolis with its high skill high paying jobs, rather than a retail development that will create a few low paying service jobs.

        Eli Lilly Establishes East Coast US Headquarters in NYC at East River Science Park

        http://blog.targethealth.com/?s=eli+lilly+east+coast+headquarters

        Renderings
        http://www.nycbiotech.org/east_river.html
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      • Local TIF Becomes Lilly ATM Machine
        Common CentsNovember 23, 2010 11:50 AM
        What's so tragic is the percentage of public support for this project compared to the much larger New York deal that was struck with Eli Lilly.

        New York is giving only a fraction of the public dollars Indianapolis is proposing, yet New York is getting $700 million in private investment.
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        • New York...
          MaxNovember 23, 2010 12:06 PM
          New York has a few things going for it that Indy doesn't, and obviously the public dollars aren't enough to make up for it. New York has excellent public transit and a pedestrian-friendly atmosphere. New York has taken steps to make itself more environmentally friendly. New York has worked towards having a healthy population. Not to mention that the creative, high-skill individuals who will be filling the Lilly jobs in New York would be appalled at how backwards the population of Indy can be on even slightly progressive positions. I agree with your point though. Indy would be far better served using the money to change the problems I just listed.
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        • Fair Is Fair
          Public EnforcerNovember 23, 2010 12:36 PM
          Eli Lilly is shrinking in Indianapolis and certainly did not meet its job creation or investment obligations made with former Mayor Stephen Goldsmith, so why are we paying them instead of Eli Lilly repaying us?

          An (Eli) Lilly Blooms in Indianapolis:
          Incentives of $214 Million Power $1 Billion, 7,500-Job Deal

          http://www.siteselection.com/ssinsider/incentive/ti9909.htm
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        • You kidding me?
          KAWNovember 23, 2010 1:05 PM
          Really? With the billions of dollars Lilly has contributed to this city, you're complaining about them using their money to develop their east coast headquarters in NYC? What is wrong with you?
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        • IndymanNovember 23, 2010 2:08 PM
          Common Cents, as was stated last time you brought up that argument, we are not giving Lilly any money. What we are doing is guaranteeing a loan to the developer. Big difference.

          As far a Lilly spending money here, they have spent quite a bit developing their facilities here. They are not doing a project like the NYC here because the already have that and more.

          The reason they are "shrinking" is to stay competitive. They are dedicated to staying in Indiana and remaining an Indiana company. If they took the easy way and sold out to another company, you would really see shrinkage.
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        • City Should Be Partner, Not Doormat
          Common CentsNovember 23, 2010 2:49 PM
          We are giving Eli Lilly money.

          The City will float a bond up to $98 million, loan the No-So developer up to $86 million, pay the first three years of interest only payments from the proceeds of the bond, put in $9 million of infrastructure, pay Eli Lilly $14 million from an old loan on the Harding Street TIF (which Lilly will give to the developer), turn over its $5 million in proceeds from the area being designated a 'Certified Technology Park' to the developer, and help the developer pay the loan back by applying 100% of all property taxes collected in the area for 10 years.

          Yes, Eli Lilly does need to adjust to a shrinking pipeline of profitable drugs, however they should keep there promises to the city or repay the unearned portion of the $214 million of government incentives we gave them last time. A deal is a deal, just ask Jim Irsay or Herb Simon.

          http://hadenoughindy.blogspot.com/2010/11/schedule-of-hearings-for-citys-98.html
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        • Site Plan
          American DirtNovember 23, 2010 10:15 PM
          Judging from the Virginia Avenue frontage, this portion of the Cultural Trail will run alongside a giant surface parking lot.
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        • End of Story
          FredNovember 24, 2010 7:23 AM
          Every private lender that looked at this project rejected it as too risky. I'm sorry if the people who make a living investing money say its too risky then I have no reason to blieve the people who do not make a living investing money, i.e. the Mayor, is smarter than those private lenders about what a good investment.

          This project is nothing more than an insider political job. The lobbyist to the Mayor's Office for the project is Marion County GOP Chairman Tom John. End of Story. This project should summarily be rejected by the council.
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          • End of Story???
            BerwickGuyNovember 24, 2010 10:11 AM
            Gee, Fred, perhaps the mayor and the council should bow to your ultimate wisdom. Since you seem to have all the answers, why listen to them?

            You went way beyond making your point with legitimate concerns and turned yourself into a nut job.

            Gut-"wrenching"......
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          • North Of Fantasyland
            Concerned Downtown TaxpayerNovember 24, 2010 2:10 PM
            Don't worry Brad Chambers. Christmas is coming up and maybe you can ask Santa for the money.It's clear that some of the city officials also still believe.If things go south for the North of Fantasyland project
            the taxpayers will be left holding Santa's empty sack. Wake up and smell the coffee.
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          • It's Going To Take A Lot More Than A Hotel
            ZuluNovember 24, 2010 4:27 PM
            Sadly for the entire city, it's going to take a hell of a lot more than a hotel project to cure Lilly's ills.People of Indianapolis may want to brace themselves for life with a much smaller Lilly. Unfortunately if your not growin your goin...
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