Saxony map features upscale tenants

October 26, 2007
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ShopperIs it a wish list, or are some of the nation's top retailers eyeing the Saxony project in Hamilton County? Some big names, including Lacoste, North Face and Polo, appear on a map shared with retailers and brokers at a shopping center convention in Chicago Thursday. Other names include Aldo, Jared, JCrew, Tommy Hilfiger, Polo, Coach, Forever 21 and bebe. Restaurant spaces show a McCormick and Schmick's and California Pizza Kitchen. Locally based Situs Realty Corp. is leasing the new center, which would sit on the Fishers side of the 725-acre Saxony development. The developer is Republic Development. Situs President Keith Stark called the names "tentative" since the company is in the "very early stages of leasing." He said the 800,000-square-foot shopping center would open in 2009.
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  • I'm REALLY sick of hearing all this god-awful suburban growth! It's really quite disturbing if you ask me. :(
  • Yet the Venu I am entirely supportive of. As it is IN Marion County! :)
  • Those stores would be nice but consider when Clay Terrace 1st announced
    tentative tenants the Container Store & Kenneth Cole were listed.
    They didn't show & I doubt these will either.
  • So it's an outlet mall? ;-) A bunch of those brands are already 40 minutes south of town in the Edinburgh Outlets.
  • I agree with Erich. Indiana (Hamilton County) needs this like it needs another
    roundabout. Our government needs to wise up and step in over this
    over development issue. How many shopping venues do we possibly need!
  • Its a wish list. Hamilton Town Center was touting similar upscale names at first and look at it now..JC Penney for heavens sakes!
  • Erich -- In my opinion, Venu is in the suburbs. There's nothing magical about the county border that makes one side suburbs. It seems silly to be against Saxony and for Venu based on location. Be supportive of Venu because of its density, not its location. If I had my drothers, it would be in downtown instead.
  • Well, the scary thing is that the Westfield post suggests sprawl up to over 200th street within the next few years. 20 miles from downtown. Venu is only 8-9 miles from downtown. It's FRIGHTENING to think of Keystone at the Crossing as Midtown. ...and it's getting harder and harder for me to remember that Keystone is technically the suburbs!!!

    I can remember as a kid going up the west side of 465. You could see the fire from the refinery and the sun off the Pyramids from all the way over there. Now I can't even look around me because I'm afraid I'll get barreled over by a semi going 85!!!
  • I would like to see these shops at Venu instead of Saxony, it would be a good complement to the Fashion Mall and I think they could all feed each others' business. If Saxony gets this project, I'm afraid Venu will not have such a good time at getting a wide variety or retailers that can't be found at Fashion Mall, Clay Terrace, and Saxony.
  • CorrND I support the for a number of reasons. Sure, it would have been nice to see a project of this scope downtown (and we should with Penn Centre & the refined MSA proposals) However, given the location of The Venu atleast it is IN Marion County & therefore helps the city of Indy in the long run... However, what happens in Hamilton County stays in Hamilton County which does absolutely NOTHING for Indianapolis!

    I also, saw that Indiana ranked near dead last for environmental grades in the most recent issue of Forbes Magazine! I find this utterly appaling. Given that most businessess locate on how well a place performs in this. So we REALLY need to clean up!

    On a brighter note a number of projects announced or underway in Indy are i think greening the way (cause paving the way isnt so environmentaly sound) yet the projects are i believe our under construction & under appreciated new midfield terminal, 3 Mass Ave, The Venu (which very well may be the BIGGEST green project built in the country as well as the proposed Ralston Square... Hopefully, this is only the beginning & projects like the JW Hotel Complex get the green light to go green too!
  • I'm all for urban infill and seeing Venu succeed. However, I don't think Saxony will be nearly as horrendous as everyone is making it sound. It looks like a semi-decent attempt at breaking the suburban mold. At least its a mix use development with some density. If suburbs had always been planned with the sort of village mentality that is in vogue right now, I don't think we'd be nearly as up in arms about sprawl. Give those that are doing it right a chance.
  • I don't think there is anything special about any of those retailers. I would hope that a place like Venu would get a better selection than these.
  • I agree Urbanophile! Such a misleading title to the thread. I was expecting to read names like Burberry, Hermes, Louis Vuitton, Prada & Fendi. No truly upscale retailer would ever waste a second on the demographics up there.
  • I could see something like Burberry in Indianapolis. But Hermes? It seems dubious to me. It would be much easier for these companies to simply sell their products through Saks or something instead of a standalone boutique in a market like Indianapolis. Indeed, that's pretty much what Louis Vuitton does. If the department stores sales are high enough, then it might justify a boutique.

    I don't know how the women's wear selection stacks up, but the menswear collection at Saks Fashion Mall is shockingly poor. There is very little there I would actually consider buying were I in the market for upscale clothing. Until Saks can demonstrate its ability to sell a higher end merchandise mix, I'm skeptical on luxury stores setting up standalone shops. Although clearly the retail mix at places like Keystone Crossing is trending upwards significantly.
  • Urbanophile... your last entry was of no surprise to me. It's pretty apparent the market in Indy for mens stylish/fashionable clothing is very dour.
  • Well Charlotte has an Hermes, so its not totally out of the question for Indy to get one.
  • Erich, Indiana will rank low in any environmental ranking that simply measures reported discharges because we have one of the largest petroleum refineries in the world and one of the largest steelmaking complexes in the world, as well as a high dependence on heavy manufacturing that involves a fair amount of raw-material or intermediate processing.

    Cummins, Cat, and International all make diesel engines here, GM and Toyota build trucks, and Subaru and Honda have car factories. There's a huge plastics plant in Mount Vernon on the Ohio River. Petrochemicals and heavy-metal manufacturing are energy-intensive (smokestack emissions) and produce lots of waste byproducts. And the state's electric utilities largely rely on coal-fired electric plants that provide the juice for all our computers.

    I'd wager that Texas ranked similarly low for their concentrations of petrochemical facilities, but Texas continues to boom.

    I'd also wager that smart business decision-makers try to understand the reasons for rankings like these instead of just reading and reacting as you've done.
  • And what's that supposed to imply? I still find it appaling regardless of how much industry we might have. Quite honestly, there's A LOT that can & should be done. End of story...
  • Eric,

    Saxony has been under development for SEVERAL years. The project is not new, only the news that there are tenants for it. Quit griping.
  • I'm not griping. Just upset about how ignorant many of us are to the environment!
  • I really get sick of this war between city and suburbs. These two things are not opposed to one another but are complementary. Indianapolis needs those upscale stores and retail developments in the suburbs to attract the upper middle class and wealthy. At the same time by providing things downtown such as museums, conventions, sporting events, and nice downtown ambience Indianapolis gets to attract these people to the city. I hear people from all over including Chicago tell me how much they love Downtown Indianapolis. I think a lot of people are surprised when they come here and find that there is more to do than they thought. Just keep the right perspective and try not to forget that Hamilton county is part of the metropolitan area of Indianapolis.
  • Erich, it is also upsetting to know how many environmentalists are ignorant of economic and historical reality. Indiana has no mountains and about twenty miles of beachfront. What we do have in abundance is flat land and people, and our location is in the heart of the country. Our development patterns for the past 150 years reflect those realities and involve massive capital investment in manufacturing and transportation that can't be replaced overnight.

    Our bad grades on both environmental and sprawl report cards reflect that massive capital investment as well. It doesn't mean we aren't sensitive to the need for change, it only means that we have what we have.

    The thing that will change the perceived need for all these sprawling new developments further and further from the urban core is unsold new houses and empty new storefronts. I don't think that will happen by preaching about corporations, developers, and their impact on the environment. I think it will happen when people connect their own individual choices with environmental protection and begin making choices that decrease their footprints.
  • Wow, Saxony is a love/hate kind of project it appears. I live about a half mile from the project. To me, I think it is amazing. It is loosely based new urbanism that provides some long-term flexibility and a center for an area that has undergone serious sprawl. To have several centers nearby will help to focus growth around those areas.

    High-end tenants would be nice there and at the new mall across 69. I cannot wait for both of those to reach completion. Why are people so anti when it comes to projects like these. People just can't stand to see Fishers do well. I hope every major area can lure and attract high end clients/tenants and don't try to diminish an area that happens to do so. Fishers is a great area to live. Carmel, Westfield, Noblesville all have a sister-city way of things with Fishers in my opinion and I hope each town continues to make progress and secure progressive developments like Saxony, West Clay, Clay Terrace, Westfields new project, Hamilton Town Center, etc... Looking forward to it, but don't understand people's criticisms.
  • I totally agree with DRT. Why is there such hostility against the suburbs? While some wouldn't live anywhere else than downtown, others want the burbs. There do seem to be people that don't want to see Fishers--or any northern suburb--prosper. As a resident of Saxony I say bring on the retail. That's one of the reasons why we purchased our home there and in a few years, hopefully, it will be a place where we can walk to any number of health care and retail locations.
  • What city folk like me have against suburban growth is the inevitable whining about roads and congestion, and the necessity to spend bazillions of our state highway dollars so y'all can get downtown in 30 minutes for a year or two until more people move in further out and clog things up again.

    Elsewhere on this blog is a post about the $600million I-69/I-465 fix. Folks, they're related: Suburban/exurban growth = congestion.

    Why? Because your road grids out in the boondocks were built on one-mile squares. When the 640 acres in each square mile get divided up into 1500, 2000 or more homesites, the 4000 or 5000 cars that live inside that mile square all have to use the four intersections at the corners of their mile square to go everywhere...behind the school busses.

    Mile after mile on those roads...116th, 126th, Gray, Hazel Dell, Cumberland, Olio, Cyntheanne etc....the effect is cumulative. You are building your way INTO congestion that you can never build out of. Roundabouts will only work for a while. You don't have the pressure relief inherent in an urban street grid with five or ten cross streets per mile; everyone must pass through choke points to go everywhere.
  • How about an IKEA??
  • Tenantive means they don't have deals with any of them. It's an old developer trick to put those names on the plan so you can pretend like you have deals with them. If those deals were available they would have already been made across the street at Hamilton Town Center.
  • I would expect Indianapolis to get thjese stores in one of the many planned retail projects; however, the expansion at the Fashion Mall is where they more than likely go. Kenneth Cole is a definite (at least that is the word I am hearing) and Burberry is also being mentioned.
  • James: Obviously you don't know diddly squat! Do you realize that every development starts out as tentative until Letters of Intent are signed and then leases. EVERY developer in the country has proposed tenants that they would like to see at their development. Quite a lot of planning goes into a marketing plan, as it's not just throwing darts at a list of retailers and then calling them. Simon's Hamilton Town Center is not being billed as an upscale development with JCPenney, Dick's Sporting Goods, Dress Barn, etc. Those are not high fashion tenants and some of the tenants listed for Saxony will NOT go into that tenant mix with discount retailers.

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