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If the problem is the trucks why not just toll the trucks? Nobody wants this proposal. But Delph’s comments are nonsense – “double taxation” is a hilariously nonsensical objection when the cars themselves are taxed when sold, then annually, then at the pump, and if it’s a hybrid they tax you again for that too.
I’m an EV owner and I pay three times as much in tax than the average gasoline-powered vehicle owner does in both registration fees and gas taxes.
The problem is vehicle weight. Road damage is a geometric function of weight, so trucks definitely should pay more.
That applies to passenger vehicles as well: EVs are much heavier than their internal-combustion engine counterparts of similar size, and somewhat heavier than hybrids the same size. (The Chevrolet Silverado EV is significantly heavier than the regular gas-powered Silverado 1500, with EV models weighing roughly 8,500–9,000+ lbs compared to the gas version’s 4,700–5,800 lbs.) This is why you pay more tax for an EV…it does more road damage than my midsize SUV with an ICE.
Oh, I totally agree! I think I should have expanded on my point in that taxes for EV owners are cranked up almost every other year while the Federal gas tax hasn’t been adjusted for inflation since 1993 and is effectively worthless.
Just say no to taxing through tolling for cars.
“I always look forward to crossing the Ohio River into Kentucky and traveling on those three beautiful lanes, in both directions, all the way to Tennessee — which they have miraculously, somehow figured out how to do without any tolls,”
How is it that our state – under a republican administration since – oh, 2005 and our Congressional delegation, have failed to obtain funding for our highways? Mitch McConnell certainly took care of Kentucky. Braun was an empty seat in the Senate as he is currently here in Indiana.
The Federal gas tax hasn’t been adjusted for inflation since 1993, it’s basically worthless. The Highway Trust Fund has only been kept afloat through General Fund infusions. It will be insolvent by 2030 because it’s too politically unpopular to actually have people and businesses pay for the infrastructure and services that they use.
How are we different? We have decided as a state that we will not invest any tax dollars into roads that aren’t gas taxes. We choose to limit what we spend on roads.
““Infrastructure is the one thing that we’ve always financed through user fees, so that you don’t tax the general public if they don’t drive a car or they don’t go on this road”.
The attitude that only people who use something should pay for it, despite the cost/benefit for all of society, is at the root of many of Indiana’s shortcomings compared to other states. It’s almost as though baby boomers are willfully forgetting the massive government investment that was made into their lives, because it somehow makes them feel weak to admit that, no, they didn’t do it all by themselves.
We could have quite lovely infrastructure if we just had the will to pay for it. Instead, we continually cut taxes the profess we can’t afford things.
This would make sense **IF** it also funded an alternative to the tolling (intercity buses and/or trains). Otherwise, it just feels like entrapment.
A.R. is not only one of the most well-informed commenter in these forums, he/she also has the best ideas. Have you considered running for office?
The potholes in I-70 ought to be fixed first. The road condition is miserable.
Low information voters: “Fix the potholes on the highways! 🤬”
State Government: “sure, but we might need to raise taxes to do that.”
LIV’s: “Raise my taxes?! Why, so you can give it to [insert migrant population that the president or VP made up lies about this week.] Fox the city roads instead!! 🤬🤬”
Local Government: “we’d love to. We just got a grant to repave a major thoroughway that runs through the whole city, and we get to improve all the infrastructure around it to, we just have to build some nice bus stops to get the funding.”
LIV’s: “Bust stops?! Why, so the poors have a way to get around?! Just fix the 🤬 potholes!!”
Low Information Voters – Demanding things they don’t want to pay for since 1776.
+1 Michael.
Micheal N.
Filling potholes is the immediate need!!! SO FIX THEM! No one wants damage done to their cars.
People feel they are already taxed enough. They feel that way because that is what they are constantly told.
I get that we need more tax revenue,
but make a good case to the public at large. People are NOT stupid. Just explain it without getting all wonky.
No tolls!!!! We have the 5th highest gasoline sales taxes in the US!!! We also have billions in state surplus in addition to a friendly national DOT which should, given that I-70 is an INTERSTATE!!!, contribute millions to the six-lane project! I’m in favor of six lanes of newly paved I-70….but not at the cost of tolls! If you can’t get Duffy to include it in the national DOT budget and we can’t afford it with the current tax structure, then, so be it…no expansion!!!!!!!
Yes, without more details this is difficult to draw a real opinion. It seems this could not function well inside the 465 loop, or even east of the airport exit. With downtown hosting both I70 and I65 and their shared N/S splits, it’s almost physically impossible to control and charge tolls for this 2-3 mile section. The idea of jumping on I70 at Shadeland and running to just Emerson to visit aunt Betty makes no sense. Each entrance-exit has to have 4 toll booths, which require extra space in both length and width. West St to Madison-ill St exits would be like throwing sticks in our spokes. Within the I465 loop there is no room for such toll infrastructure, and it all cannot be done with just cameras, they only act as back ups to cheaters. The toll system seems to only be viable outside of 465.
Kevin, nearly every toll system across the nation is open road, meaning no booths. The Indiana Toll Road and Chicago Skyway are anomalies. Any tolling infrastructure added on I-70 would surely be open road tolling like the I-65 Ohio River bridge (unless someone in the Legislature owns a toll booth construction company).
The solution through downtown is easy that it isn’t covered. Tolls gantries are erected before/after the north and south split, or potentially and exemption is worked out for within 465. I am generally opposed to tolling the interstates, but understand with how our State legislature approaches taxes it is more than likely should the Feds approve a request. The infrastructure is far less painful than you have past experiences with.
The bigger wonder I always have is individuals crossing the through the state without a toll tag. How much is the cost to track down and bill them based on license plate (and is it actually collected) versus the $25 they would owe. I am estimating the extra fee for paying by plate versus a toll tag. Interstate truckers I would imagine are universally outfitted with toll tags at this point.
All of this unfunded expansion and Governor Braun is still pushing his wishful I-64 to I-69 $4 BILLION dollar highway project. Who would be the biggest benefactor of that boondoggle? You guessed it…Braun’s trucking enterprise that he owns in Jasper County. Gotta love politicians.
Troy, exactly!!! Free for me, and well raspberries to thee.
Why not I-69 between Indianapolis and Jasper with no exemptions for the Gov and his family. If they are tolling cars, then yes the vast majority will be Hoosiers and not people from out-of-state. Also have to wonder how many locals with ditch I-70 for US 40 to avoid the tolls and create issues on that roadway. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.
FINALLY, someone GETS IT!!!! THANK YOU!!!
No one with a brain will ditch I-70 for US40. It’s 2-2.5 hours across Indiana on 70 (depending on your choice of speed). It’s closer to 4 hours on US40 dragging through Richmond, Cambridge City, Knights Knightstown, Greenfield, Cumberland, Indy, Plainfield, Clayton, Putnamville, Brazil, Terre Haute, and West Terre Haute.
What’s more likely is that trucks to/from St. Louis and points east would use I-64 to Louisville, pay the bridge tolls, and then take I-71 to Cincinnati and Columbus. It’s less than 50 miles/about 45 minutes “out of the way” but cheaper for a through trucker than the proposed toll.
That decision will be based on a time savings evaluation.
Some people will pay more to save time. Others will not.
What if the federal Highway Administration decides to take the toll revenue generated on a federal interstate highway